Bass in small rooms

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angelface
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Bass in small rooms

Postby angelface » Fri Jun 02, 2017 10:50 am

My current hi-fi room is 3.5 metres by 5 metres so

I have a pair of Wilson Benesch Arcs but sometimes I wish I had a bit more bass. Sometimes dream of big floor standers such as B&W 800D as they can be reasonable s/h.

Is this possible in such a small room? I already have 3 full range sound absorbtion panels for GIK acoustics on first reflection points that have improved the bass but if I bought some more could I avoid the boominess associated with big speakers in small rooms?

What about a sub? My current sub in the lounge is not a good match for my speakers (not fast enough) and my current listening room is smaller. If floor standers are not an option why would a sub be better?
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Re: Bass in small rooms

Postby border » Fri Jun 02, 2017 11:42 am

I had some PMC gb1`s on my mono x set up for a while in a room about that size.
Never had a problem with boomy bass even at very high volumes,possibly because they are front ported.

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Re: Bass in small rooms

Postby hifinutt » Fri Jun 02, 2017 3:57 pm

interesting to see quite a few people buy big b&w speakers and then sell them again as not suitable for the room

I had some lovely diablo once and they had a beautiful sweet sound but did not have the depth of floorstanders . I currently use verity audio Rienzi [look at youtube] , now these are sweet, transparent and emotional in sound . they have the detail of the diablo and the depth of a floorstander . they also have a woofer which is forward or backward and they fit the room well

I am not suggesting you buy Rienzi because they are very rare but it is possible to find a floorstander with more bass without overwhelming the room with big B&W . I also though about subs but I have little room for one

I suppose you have thought about a torus ?
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Re: Bass in small rooms

Postby MiniCoupeman » Fri Jun 02, 2017 4:37 pm

You like your speakers. Change them and you could end up unhappy - more likely than delighted unless you spend a LOT more. Have you considered a quality Sub? You control the bass. Unless I had a Barn I would always favour quality stand mounts with a sub over bull in a china shop floor standees.

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Re: Bass in small rooms

Postby Starwarsmike2422 » Fri Jun 02, 2017 4:45 pm

Why not get a Torus sub? Will integrate well with your ARC's. You'll get proper bass rather than boom, & you'll have full control over the amount of bass level.
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Re: Bass in small rooms

Postby crimsondonkey » Fri Jun 02, 2017 4:50 pm

There's a reason big B&W speakers are cheap second hand.

If you want to work out how much additional bass your room can stand then having it acoustically measured is a good idea.

If you like every other aspect of your speakers sound then getting a very fast sub would be the best bet. Each time you change speakers you take a gamble that you'll be able to integrate them in your room.

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Re: Bass in small rooms

Postby angelface » Mon Jun 05, 2017 5:03 pm

I have thought about a Torus but they are a lot more expensive than my speakers even second hand.

I do love my speakers. I have thought about Curves (same as Arcs but extra bass driver in a floor stander) but worried about boom. I have also thought about Vertex (updated version of Arcs with WB tweeter and next generation mid/bass cone) but still expensive second hand.

This question is more from the point of view of acoustic panels. Could I eliminate bass problems by just adding the relevant panels?

I recently bought two more panels and it was like having new speakers.
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Re: Bass in small rooms

Postby MiniCoupeman » Tue Jun 06, 2017 10:46 am

I use acoustic panels including bass traps in two corners. They are very effective ( I have a very small room and use PMC 21's and a REL sub ( very, very low) I works a treat and I favourabley reviewed acoustic treatment but as a fellow CU 'er pointed out - they are not wfh friendly - or even a passing stranger friendly for that matter. My problem is forced on me by the size of my room. Yours is a choice. Given that choice, stay with what you like and try a decent Sub. eBay usually has a range of affordable RELs and if it doesn't work, sell it on.

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Re: Bass in small rooms

Postby angelface » Tue Jun 06, 2017 12:34 pm

I have a Monitor Audio RXW12 sub but it never seemed fast enough for my speakers so it stayed downstairs with my home cinema system.
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Re: Bass in small rooms

Postby Ives » Tue Jun 06, 2017 12:48 pm

I will let you know in a couple of months.
I have a room mesuring 4,4 by 5,5 m which I will turn into my mancave.
In my opinion there is a rather serious bass problem now (with DIY 2 1/2 speakers so not even full range, let alone if one were to install B&W Diamonds).
The acoustic panels have already been delivered by GIK Acoustics.
For this room I bought upon their recommendation:
6 244 bas traps
4 tri traps
2 alpha panels

Later this month I will install parquet floor and then install my kit.

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Re: Bass in small rooms

Postby angelface » Tue Jun 06, 2017 1:04 pm

I currently have 3 GIK 244 panels.
CDXTSE2/PSX-R(Nordost Silver Line)BC DAC3.7VB(Atlas Navigator)BC Pre3VB(Atlas Navigator)2xMonoX(Coherent 4D)WB Arc
HUMAX Freesat+/Sony BDPS280>AVMaster8 and SP+>Spendor C5e>> Monitor Audio RXW12 sub>>4xSpendor SR5

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Re: Bass in small rooms

Postby Ives » Tue Jun 06, 2017 1:14 pm

By the looks of what they recommended for my situation, I suspect there is room for improvement in your room.
The recommendation was:
- tri-traps in the corners in front of the speakers
- 244's on the ceiling in front of each speaker
- 244's on each side to cope with first and second reflections
- alpha's directly behind the listening position
Everything will be put on stands (except of course the ones on the ceiling), so I will be free to experiment a bit.
And I will do that :P Keep you informed.

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Re: Bass in small rooms

Postby MiniCoupeman » Tue Jun 06, 2017 5:20 pm

I love parquet flooring, but in a room with music? You must be joking, you will have more reflections than the Hall of Versailles. Sorry. This not going to work!

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Re: Bass in small rooms

Postby Ives » Tue Jun 06, 2017 5:40 pm

MiniCoupeman wrote:I love parquet flooring, but in a room with music? You must be joking, you will have more reflections than the Hall of Versailles. Sorry. This not going to work!

I know. Which is why I will put a rug on it between the speakers and my listening position.

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Re: Bass in small rooms

Postby Lancashirelad » Tue Jun 06, 2017 5:54 pm

Much depends on construction of subfloor, & rugs work wonders (as long as they are made of natural wool from sheep eating only organic grass on western facing slopes!). I wonder whether the needs of the hifi should absolutely dictate all aesthetic decisions/choices...


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